I've been doing a bit of research on the XG-lube ingredients discussed here, and thought I'd share what I've found.
Methylparaben is bad. There's a reason why some organic/natural products claim to be "paraben-free." Methylparaben, along with propylparaben and others, apparently acts as an endocrine disruptor, i.e. an estrogen-like chemical that can throw one's hormones out of whack. Its use in cosmetic products is banned in Europe.
(Heck, just Google for "methylparaben endocrine" and see what you get)
Optiphen looks somewhat better, but... Still a bit scary, y'know? There's not exactly a whole lot of research behind this one.
Note that there are several variants of Optiphen (Optiphen ND, Optiphen Plus et al.). This discussion has only been concerned with the "plain" Optiphen, which is the only one Snowdrift Farms sells anyway.
Grapefruit seed extract doesn't work as a preservative. When it does work, it's because the GSE itself has preservatives!
There's not a lot of good options for preservatives out there. Many safer ones, like sodium benzoate and potassium sorbate, can only be used if the formulation is somewhat acidic. Above a certain pH, they're ineffective as a preservative. I suppose you could add in some citric acid crystals to bump up the acidity a bit, but that sure ups the PITA factor as well.
What I've been doing is making somewhat large-ish batches sans preservative, keeping them in the refrigerator, and pouring out / microwaving small amounts as they are needed. So far, it's worked fine. No moldy lube yet!
Xanthan gum may be safe for anal use. I didn't find any reference stating so outright, but Googling for "xanthan gum rectal" turns up various instances of its use in rectal gels/enemas for drug delivery:
__http://books.google.com/books?id=yStnG3eLhhIC&pg=PA434&dq="xanthan+gum"+re ctal__ (remove the space in "re ctal")
My own understanding is that xanthan gum in itself is a polysaccharide, a.k.a. a complex carbohydrate. If you look at the Nutrition Facts label on the bag, it bears this out: of a 1 tbsp / 9g serving size, 7g is listed as dietary fiber. So sticking that up your bum should be no worse than sticking in Metamucil
(The only ill effect I can imagine is that bacteria in the rectum feast on the carbs, but this would be even more an issue with glycerine/glycerol, basically a sugar, and yet glycerine is used in suppositories and anal-lube jellies all the time.)
I just finished with my first Xanthan Gum Flight and oh my god. I haven't flown in a few weeks because I've been sick and no sex drive. I also loathe and despise using conventional lubes because of how sticky they get and I get them on my hands and the Fl case, it's all a big mess that often significantly degrades the experience. After reading this thread and a lot of prodding from Don't bother me i'm flying I decided to get it.
Solved all of my problems! I used 1/4 of a teaspoon with 100ml of water. Not sticky at all, it dries properly without residual stickness and it lasted me long enough, even though the flight was only about 3 minutes I'd have no problem reapplying this. It's also extrmely cheap. I have this problem with normal lubes because I'm poor and I'm always afraid that I'll use too much or run out too quickly and it adds a level of anxiety to my flights. I got a 15 gram batch of gum and I think it'll last me a long long time.
I held off on getting the glycerin and the gse extract, although bobs excellent research (well done mate, now I know it's ok to use on my anal toys as well, thanks a lot!) has made me pause on the gse temporarily, until I knew I liked the base lube, now I'm off hunting for glycerin.
Another good thing is that I'm uncut and extremely sensitive (I didn't pull back my foreskin even a little bit until i was 16 or so, it hurts to touch if its not well lubricated and even then I'm careful) and many lubes really irritate my urethra. This was absolutely fine, no irritation it was just like showering.
I can safely recommend this to any guy who owns a fleshlight, whether they're unhappy with their current lube or not, it gets 5 stars in every category.
edit : lol really should proofread it, accidentally wrote that i used 100ml of milk.
An airtight container seems to make a big difference in how long it lasts. I don't use any preservatives and when I kept it in a small squeeze bottle, even keeping it in the fridge, it would only last a couple of days before it started to smell bad. I switched to using a pill container with a childproof lid, the container is clear orange, and the lid makes a really tight seal. Now I always use it up before it starts to smell bad.
I've experimented with the formula a bit. Boosting the amount of glycerin, to about 1/3 to 1/2 of the final volume, helps the formula a lot. (This is easy to do when you buy glycerin by the gallon )
The thing to note is that glycerin is hygroscopic; it attracts water. It's used, for example, to dry out flowers for preservation. So if you saturate it with at least an equal volume of water, you end up with this "heavy water" mixture that evaporates a lot more slowly than plain water (and still leaves the glycerin behind, which doesn't evaporate). You thicken that with XG in the usual manner, and shazam, you have lube that doesn't dry out. Besides that, the extra glycerin gives the lube a nice, smooth, gel-like consistency.
Be careful where this stuff drips, of course. Non-evaporation is great on your body, not so great on your bedsheets or carpeting
I've also tried adding aloe vera gel to the mix, but unfortunately, all this seems to do is make it stickier. This is noticeable when you have large surface areas in contact with each other (like legs), and you pull them apart.
I was able to find Xanthan Gum at my local Krogers. It was in the produce department. It was the big bag, I think its Bob Mills or something $11.99.
Whats the verdict on preservatives? I have been using a little bit of rubbing alcohol 71% in an 4 ounce bottle that I replenish with a new mixture about once a week.
1st post! Great forum and community you guys got here.
The main risk is that the stuff gets into and irritates your urethra, but if that's not a problem for you, and the fumes aren't a bother, then I don't think there's much to worry about.
I ordered some liquid Optiphen the day after my post. I'm not thrilled about the possible long term effects of using alcohol. My hope is that the Optiphen will be able to preserve a 8-16oz quantity for a couple weeks up to a month at a time. I've heard good things about Optiphen.
Has anybody ever heaten up xantham gum? (standard recipe, just it and water, nothing else) for warm lube? Would it spoil the lube? Safe to microwave or just put the bottle in some hot water?
a fellow friend of mine made her own cosmetics, and she told me that she put liquid vitamin e in her cremes to preserve them. So i went to my local health shop and bought a tiny bottle of "Vitamin E extract 40.000UI" for like $10. I added just a few drops to my mix, filled it in a pump bottle i got at the dollar store and it's still good after nine days. Most of my batches were funky after day three, but the vitamin E really seems to help.
Plus, from what i read it's really good for your skin, so i can see it being beneficial when it's being massaged into your dick by that fleshlight.
Just thought i'd pass that on.
The only question I have is if vitamin E oil will have a long term effect on the fleshlight... I would be careful what you use.
Plus, you use like a drop in two cups of lube...
Another good thing you can add is peppermint extract. You add about 5 drops on 250mls of lube, it is the same active ingredient that is in all those "tingling" or "cooling" type lubricants.
If you want a lubricant that has "warming" properties use water : glycerin in a 1:5 mix and add nothing further (and the desired amount of gum of course).
Also, you can add drops of food coloring to give your lube a more appealing color (like light blue), use like half a drop, that'll be plenty.
Gotta add my two cents about this formula.
Works great. Got a pretty hefty bag of xantham gum in the healthy/organic section of my local grocery store.
I make it in small batches of 2 ounces, and I keep it in a little hand sanitizer squirt bottle. That way it's 100% discreet and I can keep it right next to my computer with no suspicion.
I prefer a thicker consistency because I find it doesn't drip or make a mess. I use about .5 - .75 teaspoon for 2 ounces. It's about the consistency of an aloe gel or thick hand sanitizer.
I find that it's much easier to mix when you shake it rather than stirring. I make a batch in a tupperware bowl, snap on the lid, and shake it hard for a few minutes. There are no clumps and it's completely mixed.
I'm considering trying a drop of alcohol in it to keep it sterile. I have used my fleshlight without drying it after cleaning, so I know alcohol doesn't burn my penis. I'll edit with the results in a week or two with how the batch looks with alcohol in it.
how do you guys mix xanthan gum? I tried and it got so clumpy....
Put the water in a small tupperware bowl with a lid. I suppose any sealed container will work: a water bottle sounds good too.
Then I put in a small portion of the xantham and put the lid on, and shook it up until it was dissolved. Then I put a little bit more and shook it up, then a little bit more.
Don't just dump the whole teaspoon (or whatever measurement) in at once and try to mix it, it'll all clump together. Do it a little bit at a time.
k well just used fleshlight twice with xanthan gum and it worked great. It never got sticky or anything. I bought a $3-4 bag and it seems as if the bag could last me all year lol. Does anyone know hoe long the powder lasts? does it even expire?
As for mixing, someone above me suggested to just let it sit overnight and sure enough this did the trick.
Use a tiny amount of xanthan gum and add some water and you got yourself some really good lube
The clumps don't go away straight off the bat. Usually I use boiling water and stir it a lot. It just takes a while to dissolve. Time will fix it. lems make sure you store it in a sealed case. The powder can go off and affect the quality of the lube (as I have sadly discovered).
I came across this thread awhile back and figured I would give it a try since lube with the FL can get expensive (for lube at least). I've only used a handful of lubes but this stuff blows all the others away. Not only is it dirt cheap and extremely easy to mix, but you can adjust the viscosity with the amount of Xanthan Gum you use.
I'm trying to find a decent preservative for cheap, but I've found Fleshlube mixed with the XG Lube works as a preservative. I mixed about .5oz of Fleshlube Fire with some XG and water in the 4oz Fleshlube bottle. It still is fresh after about a week and a 1/2 where usually it goes bad in about 1/2 a week.
I looked up the ingredients in the Fleshlube and it seems that the Honeysuckle Extract is responsible for the preservatives. However, like the GSE, it seems that its simply preservatives added to the Honeysuckle Extract rather than the extract itself. The problem is the Honeysuckle Extract cost makes it better to simply mix up a batch or 2 per week of XG Lube. I'm thinking that some cheap store-bought lube like KY probably contains some type of preservative and would work well as a XG Lube additive. The XG Lube is cheap enough to make up a bath or 2 per week but it would be much less annoying to use the same batch for a couple months if possible with the help of a preservative.
Last edited by FLy-High; 02-01-2010 at 01:51 PM.
The thing is - iif you look at most store-bought bottles of lube, they almost ALWAYS include methyl/propyl parabens as a preservative.
I do somewhat share the concerns about parabens with the endocrine effect and wish there was a known-to-be-COMPLETELY safe method of REAL and TRUE preservation. However, I think the stuff about parabens are mostly concerning internal consumption - but I could be wrong. I never see parabens listed for foods.
But the simple fact is - I'd rather take my chances with parabens than inadvertently shoving malevolent microbes up my dick if a refrigerated lube happened to be a little too old. Parabens are currently classified as GRAS(Generally Regarded As Safe) by the FDA in the US.
BTW - I've had a bottle of XG lube with methylparaben that was well over 5 months old before being used up - and it didn't smell bad at all. (Yes, non-refrigerated.) And it looks like that 4 oz. canister of methylparaben powder will last just as long as my 6 oz. canister of XG, if not longer! Still making the combination incredibly cheap when compared to store-bought lube - even WITH the shipping!
What flabbergasts me is that some people will be worried about parabens while choking down a Big Mac and not think twice about that Big Mac!
It's all a matter of perspective, IMO. But that's just me.
My advice - just forget about the GSE and get some methylparaben or Optiphen (or any REAL preservative) - and be DONE with the issue of preservation once and for all.
The issue of mixing: Just mix the XG with some glycerin BEFORE adding it to the water.. And be DONE with the problem of trying to mix it with water.
These things might cost more initially, but in the long haul they'll be WELL worth it! They'll last you a long, LONG time!
I've heard everyone talking about Xanthan gum for several years now. So, I finally went to a health food store today and bought some. I wasn't sure how to mix it, so I put a tablespoon in about a pint of water and ran it through a mixer. Holy shit! This stuff looked and felt EXACTLY like the "thick and slick" pussy juice that my wife secretes when she's ovulating. I got a stiffy just playing with it and I immediately had to try it out during a Flight. OMG! I can't believe I waited so long to try this stuff!
I've been considering XG lube for a while, and since the bottle of lube I'm using is starting to dwindle I've decided to take the plunge. I found xanthum gum in 6 oz for $7 on iherb,and before I order I wanted to know if there are any suggestions on preservatives/additional ingredients I should buy. I was going to get grapefruit seed extract, but it seems inconclusive. Anyone have suggestions?
amazonedotcom has 1 pound bags for 17 bux us
Just gave this stuff a try....
So rather than ordering another gallon bottle of lube... I celebrated by ordering 4 new sleeves with all the money I'll be saving. Hah!
I take 1/4 tsp of Xantham gum and 100ml of water. More than enough per session. I don't see myself running out lube for a long time...
Yup ... I use 1/8 tsp pf Guar gum to about 60 ml of water ... one of those small Purel hand sanitizer containers is perfect ... makes more than enough for a session, and easy cleanup.
Tried XG as well, but Guar is half the price $5.50 for 260 grams (9 Oz) ... both a much easier than lubes when it comes to clean-up as well.
I'm gonna give this a try.
Are these the right products, and is this a good price? If a masturbate 4 times a week, how long will this stuff last me?
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That 2nd item was NOW VEGETABLE GLYCERINE 4 Fl. Oz. 100% Pure.
I googled this stuff and it's always talking about yeast infections. What's the word on that?
Essential Depot also has good prices on the powder; check them out.
(As I understand it, xanthan gum is nutritionally nothing more than dietary fiber. Which would lead me to believe that it is inert with respect to yeast infections.)
I'm going for the gallon of glycerine. I think I'll be enjoying my Flights a lot more with this stuff.
What part of the store are you finding this xanthan gum. I assumed it would be with baking stuff? Can't seem to find it.
Several Xanthan Gum threads, so I guess I'll just bump the monster here...
I have a few questions:
I have seen everything from Rosemary Leaf Extract to Grapefruit Seed Extract to Methlyparaben powder (I can't find this one *anywhere*) as possible preservatives... Does anyone have a good tried-and-true suggestion for the Preservative for Xanthan lube being stored at room temperature?
Glycerin seems expensive, especially since you actually seem to need a bunch of it (relatively at least - folks talking about buying up to a gallon at a time), at some point, doesn't this start to become ballpark as expensive as a commercial lube? I'm all game for having a *better* lube, but I'd kinda like it to be cheaper too if I'm gonna be mixing my own. ...also, the main purpose of the Glycerin is just to keep the lube from drying quite so quickly, yes?
I'm starting to get a little low on lubricants, and will need to invest in more soon, so I'd kinda like to try the Xanthan Gum route to see what all the hubub is about. hah But for those Xanthan vets out there, I am wondering just how feasible this is for someone who has never mixed any before. Especially any tips concerning the finding and usage of good preservatives, which even after reading the threads here more than once each still confuses the hell out of me. (I'd be happy with methlyparaben, but I just can't find the stuff, so will have to go with an alternative I suppose.)
I only plan on making small batches, probably nothing larger than 1 to 1.5 ounces at a time, so they probably wouldn't have to sit all that long. My main concerns are skin irritation, long term Fleshlight degradation and cost. Any info/tips would be appreciated. (especially if I am overlooking something important!)
If you are only making it in small batches then you should be fine on preserving it. In fact, you may not even have to add a preservative if you use it as quickly as you say you will.
I use a capful of rubbing alcohol as a preservative in mine. I have also heard of using a little salt but I've never tried it.
If you make sure to thoroughly clean your sleeve out after each use there shouldn't be a problem with degradation.
You will also like making your own lube because you can decide how thick it should be.
Go to the supermarket to the gluten free section and you should find a decent sized bottle of it for under ten dollars (I may have bought mine for around 5 or 6 but I cant remember) that can make a lot of lube. Rubbing alcohol can be a dollar depending on the brand you buy.
"So what is this bottle next to the Duck Sauce for?"
"My Cock." heh
Hell, I may as well just put a picture of a Rooster on the bottle and label it "Cock Sauce" haha
I have 91% Isopropyl that I use to occasionally clean/sterilize my sleeves whenever I feel one might need it or before I'm going to store a sleeve for a while. (I don't use it just to dry a sleeve after every flight, moving air seems to work just fine for that purpose.) If worse comes to worse I would experiment with small amounts of that, but there is the smaller concern of it drying the lube faster, and the much larger concern of painful flights - a little alcohol in the urethra (or contact with irritated skin) sounds like a nightmare to me. I like long edging sessions, so 2 or even 3 hours of skin contact with the lube, the lube needs to be pretty inert.
All that said, I wouldn't be comfortable going with no preservative at all.
Don't worry, once you dilute it in the lube, rubbing alcohol loses its potency. Unless, of course, you use an insanely large amount of it.
I haven't had a problem with it drying too quickly or with alcohol in the urethra, but that's just me and I can't vouch for everyone.
I ran across this topic some time ago, and the other day, I just randomly decided it should be something to peruse with all of the positive reviews here. I was too impatient to order the Xanthan Gum online, so I bought it at the store, which cost me $14 for an 8oz bag. Thats the price of living in a smaller town I suppose. I picked up a small bottle of vegetable glycerin as well, both bought in the organic food section of the local supermarket. I followed dogger's recipie posted a few pages back. Here it is for reference:
Just had my first flight with the new lube a little while ago, and it is just as spectacular as everyone has been claiming. So much better than anything I have ever bought at the store. Even though I paid a higher price for the Xanthan Gum, it's still way cheaper than buying the same amount of a commercial lube. It's wonderfully slick and smooth.
Mixing the XG with the glycerin first (And thoroughly) avoided any and all clumps. One thing I did notice though that has not been mentioned is that the XG powder by itself smells really bad. Once mixed, that was pretty much gone, and the vanilla helped too. I guess thats what happens when you are using a product produced by fermentation.
I'm keeping it in a cleaned contact lens solution bottle. Fortunately, I don't wear contacts anymore. I would hate to mix up the bottles. The small nozzle on the end makes it perfect for application to the sleeve. I was going to use one of my almost empty Ky lube bottles, but as we all know, they are notorious for leakage. At least I never have to worry about them leaking again, as they are going away ASAP.
On a side note, I did try the other day to make a batch of lube with cornstartch and water. I used 4 tsp to 1 cup of water, and brought it to a boil. I think I had it on the heat too long though, as it made more of a thick gel. It was still slick, and it was ok, but the whole batch went in the trash after using the Xanthan gum lube.
I would highly recommend to anyone to try it out. I doubt there is any better lube than this.
Can someone give a definitive answer on how long it will last unrefrigerated w/out preservatives? And how long it will last in the fridge w/out preservatives?
I have a batch of lube that I made some time back for anal use (a bit thinner to allow application via syringe, plus some salt for isotonicity), but shortly thereafter, I lost interest in anal play. (Long story.) Never got around to throwing out the lube.
That had to be at least a year ago. To this day, the bottle has no visible mold inside it. I actually used some of it to test out a new toy a few weeks ago, and I specifically checked for any weird/moldy smell. None.
Maybe there was some kind of invisible, odorless mold that no one knows about that's mega-willy-unfriendly. (As in, mega-unfriendly, not just unfriendly to mega-willys!) I'm willing to bet that as long as you're okay with keeping your lube in cold storage, preservatives are a needless hassle. I certainly don't bother with them.
Thanks, bob!the!bearded, sounds promising.
I have a 2.5 fl oz bottle of Astroglide that's almost done; I was thinking about washing it out and using it for storing the XG lube. I don't live alone, so I'm not sure if I could get away with hiding it in the fridge behind the mayo. No one in my apt uses the mayo but me, so I could probably get away with it. Maybe wrap the bottle in tin foil. lol Hmmmm.
I hope this is worth it!
do you guys use liquid glycerin like this? i am interesting in making XM lube but i don't want it go bad.
Yes, pepito.. that's what I got.
If anyone's read my posts, you might have noticed that I've been very critical of the STU, my first FL that I bought back in August. I was using Astroglide, and I thought the sensation of STU/Astroglide was underwhelming. Most of my flights have been disappointing to say the least. I was even tempted to throw it in the trash.
Well, I just tried the XG lube for the first time yesterday, and Oh My God is this stuff good!! This is the best lube I've ever used by far. My first flight with this stuff was incredibly pleasurable. It felt so good, I can't even describe it.
I followed the recommended formula of:
heaping 1/4 tsp xanthan gum
3 tsp glycerin
4 ounces water
.. but for the next batch, I might make half the amount:
1/8 tsp xanthan gum
1.5 tsp glycerin
2 ounces water.
I'm assuming it will have the exact same viscosity, am I right? I want it to be the exact same!
Last edited by Bumpyride11; 11-26-2011 at 01:22 PM.
Just want to say that I've just recently returned to the world of Fleshlights after being away for three years. I was drunk on my birthday and started remembering all the good times I used to have with my STU and WW (it's been about three years since I actually owned any Fleshlights) and found a good deal on the Stoya Lotus on Amazon. I grabbed it and a 5 ounce bottle of Astroglide, since that's the lube that I always used in the past with my Fleshlights.
After receiving my FL and Astroglide, I remembered why I used to hate the stuff. I would always wonder if there was anything better out there, or if I was doomed to having to keep spitting in to my Fleshlight every minute to reactivate the lube. That's when I discovered this thread.
After reading every post here, I ordered a pound of xanthan gum powder for 15 dollars on Amazon. I just received it today and mixed up a quick batch. I used four ounces of hot water, a heaping 1/4 teaspoon of powder, and a cap full of 91 percent isopropyl alcohol. I sealed it in a Tupperware container and kept shaking it for several minutes, but there were still some clumps left. I decided to let it settle on its own and took a nap. A few hours later, the clumps were gone. I gave it another vigorous shaking and opened it up to have a look.
The consistency and colour both surprised me. Both of them highly resemble semen. I was quite surprised at how slick that it was. I dipped my fingers in it and rubbed it around for awhile and let it dry. No stickiness whatsoever left behind after it dried.
My first FLight with it was amazing. It was definitely slicker than Astroglide, and it certainly lasted longer. I lasted about four or five minutes and didn't have to spit to reactivate it, although I did add quite a bit more after around two minutes. It was certainly nice not having to worry about how much lube that I was using. In the past, I've limited myself to the bare minimum to keep it comfortable since lube is so expensive. Not so with this stuff, I just squirted as much as I wanted and it really enhanced the experience.
All in all, I'm very satisfied with this. I almost ordered a quart of Gun Oil H2O because I was skeptical of how good homemade lube could really be.
Now I just hope that I can use up all of the powder before the expiration date (April 2014). I'm using a 3 ounce Germ-X bottle to store my mixture in, and the first batch produced enough to fill it up and then plenty extra for two FLights. I'm sure that each 4 ounce batch will definitely spoil days before I can actually use all of it.